CSCP S03EP23 - Chris Hughes - Demystifying Application Security Programs

Cyber Security & Cloud Podcast

Chris Hughes is a Proven Cloud/Cybersecurity leader with nearly 20 years of experience in the Federal and commercial industries. Chris is an active blogger, passionate about all things cyber and a published author of books like Software Transparency.

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1:12 Introductions

4:45 regulation and federal space

6:40 Software supply chain attacks

8:40 SSDF and SBOM

11:06 Software is complex

15:00 Vulnerability to attacks, attacker mindset

17:00 Common supply chain attacks

20:00 Cloud critiques, is cloud secure?

23:00 Business Risk, Quantifications, How to measure everything,

24:00 FAIR and Quantification at scale

25:00 Method to evaluate vulnerability, CISA KEV, EPSS, How to triage

28:00 Why does the software supply chain get attention

30:00 Get connected

Chris Huges

https://www.linkedin.com/in/resilientcyber/

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/resilient-cyber/id1555928024

https://resilientcyber.substack.com/

FAIR: https://www.opengroup.org/certifications/openfair

Hot to measure anything in cyber risk: https://amzn.eu/d/hBWxJGO

Cyber Security and Cloud Podcast hosted by Francesco Cipollone

Twitter @FrankSEC42

Linkedin: linkedin.com/in/fracipo

#CSCP #cybermentoringmonday cybercloudpodcast.com

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Summary Transcript (auto-generated might have some typos)

Hello everyone and welcome back to the cybersecurity and cloud podcast, this is your host

Francesco and this is probably the last last episode that we do in 2022 is 29 of December 2022

we're almost on the end of the years but we managed to squeeze in a last episode with chris

Hughes and it's an absolute pleasure because we chris we've been interacting a lot of linking

teasing each other over a number of topics and we said you know it's the time to come on the

show and do a proper episode. So chris, thank you very much for coming on the show. Chris is

uh is a consultant to direct robot via and it's been in Air force previously, so it's very heavily

involved with a lot of us regulation around storm and around cybersecurity and the U. S. Has

faced a lot of change in late and today in the episode we're gonna dig in and explore this. But

before digging into the exciting topic of storm and software supply chain chris tell us a little bit

more about you, how did you start? How did you get us to the point where you are today? Yeah

definitely. I'm happy to give you some background. I start off active duty Air Force you know

prior to that I always had an interest in computers and technology but got joined the Air Force

and got put in cybersecurity and at the time I didn't really realize the opportunity. You

know you're just a young kid you know. Uh And and then like I started really taking an interest in

it because it was a fascinating career field and like I've never stopped you know I did four years in

the Air Force and then I've been a federal employee with the U. S. Government twice once with

the Navy doing cloud and deficit cops. And you know cyber security for them. And then also with

an organization known as G. S. A. The General Services Administration which probably isn't too

familiar for many. But like if you've heard of Fed ramp, I was part of the Fed ramp team

reviewing cloud services coming to the you know us federal market there as a security to me.

Um, and as you mentioned, I think we're definitely seeing like an evolution of the regulation in

this space, you know, in our, in our environment, in the public sector. You know, we've always

had things like Nist and uh, you know, risk management framework, Nist 853 and and you know,

think of Nist 871 for defense, industrial base and then see mm see that people are talking about

a lot now, thinking about, you know, not just software supply chain but supply chain risk

management in general, you're under your suppliers. That was a topic that's gotten a lot of

attention as of late and then, you know, obviously software supply chain, you know, it's not

necessarily a new topic. You know, you can date new google. Had a white paper recently,

they started like an incident from 1980 you know, for something where the United States did

something that Russia with software and it's like, wow, this issue has been around for a long

time, but it's gotten more and more attention, I think is, you know, we've seen open source

adoption kind of accelerate and go, you know, go crazy, everyone's using open source software.

Most modern applications are made of open source software and I think people are realizing like,

you know, I think prototype for example, had a study showing that in the last three years it's like

a 742% increase in software supply chain attacks. So malicious actors are paying

attention. And now I think that's making organizations regulators, you know, the industry pay

attention and try to respond to this brilliant. And then of course he moved over to cisa and kind

of has kept up that, you know, that momentum since then. So I think, you know, definitely solar

winds was kind of the watershed moment, I think from an attention perspective and then the

cyber street executive order and all the, all the activity has come after that. And as you

mentioned, like, you know, I think regulation is going to has and will continue to play a big part in

this. Like, you know, without regulation forcing the issue, suppliers are not necessarily

incentivized to provide this information that transparency and many, you know, I've been really

focused or interested in the economic factors of cyber. Many consider cyber to be a market

failure. They said, you know, regulation is required for the, for things to change. Um, and I think

it's, you know, it's hard to argue with that because if we just leave it up to the industry, they're

not going to necessarily provide this information. Why why would they, you know, just put some

additional risk or scrutiny? So, yeah, I think, I think we're definitely seeing a lot of changes And

security resolve doesn't seem like a massive cost. So if there isn't a regulation behind it, there

isn't a business justification to a ship with a bomb. I think the attack of one of the big

topic in cyber that is asset management in general. That is a huge debated and often

avoided topic in, cyber or in generally 90 is not even a cyber problem. And I think this one

kind of industry has now brought to the topic a problem that is like, what do we do with, what do